Are we preparing ourselves properly for International combat??

[emmtee83]

3. TBA membership increases and administration of the sport is streamlined to gain maximum revenue. Based on say a $40 registration fee for EVERY league bowler in the country, $15 to the National body $25 to state body. Of the State funds, $10 to representative funds $15 to local associations. From that $15 you cover awards and cheverons (the things people complained about losing). (just an idea)

Unfortunately, there is VERY little chance this will happen. Bowlers are squealing about having to pay $27.50 for a year - even though it provides a very comprehensive insurance. Cheapest insurance policy I'll ever buy! - but that's just the way I think about it.

For mine, a tariff needs to be put in place - every time ANYONE hits the lane. Even a 5c tariff would raise a huge amount of money for the sporting body - and who would know the difference?

 

[Geoff300]

This sums up where I am coming from.



I understand the gist of where you are coming from and agree.

But I also believe this is the wrong way to go about it. Look at the title for starters! Who are 'WE' and what have 'WE' ever done for bowling and the top players??

Quite frankly they way this thread was started, in my opinion, seems rather disrespectful to the bowlers who competed in the AO.

The bowlers prepare themselves, have done from the beginning. Unless they have been privy to training and support from Australian coaches and staff (without expense), or you yourself have sponsored an event appropriately. 'We' have done bugger all. I am sure PT will accept your invitation to pay for all expenses related to the preparation for the world cup from now until the event. Or are 'WE' not prepared to offer??

No matter the condition, those who won, have done so mostly off their own bat and should be congratulated as such.
Not have a cloud over their head, from a few [enter your preferred term] that are basically saying that they aren't good enough because 'WE' haven't prepared them.



Geoff's statement just reinforces [what I perceived to be] the attitude of this thread (hopefully I am wrong about this). AMP, yes has been around for a long time, has won it before and has the ability to win it again. But PT also has the ability to win it whether you think so or not. He bowled scores that were just as high in the nationals (and they were on difficult conditions). I see you are putting your hand up to sponsor the Australian teams and sponsor a few events too then Geoff??

I would not have an issue if the question was put in a better way and didn't relate to a specific event that can cast a shadow over specific bowlers, not just the winner.

Constructive criticism and suggestions are fine but we have enough 'bowlers' knocking this sport. It is getting old (almost as old as they are) and a lot of bowlers are growing tired of it.

An attitude shift is required before we can entice investment into this sport and investment is needed before we can truly prepare our own.

Let's commence phase one already people!

My $0.05.

If you read my first comment I started by offering my congrats
to the bowlers, That is the first point

The second point you made about sponsorship, Sorry I dont
really get what you are saying

Third point is , I am not questioning the ability of some bowlers
I AM questioning the very High unrealistic scores
IF the results were the same and there was 1 x 300 game bowled
and the averages were lower you would immediately have
gained more credability

Secondly to the above the reality is without specific serious coaching
and equipment modifications these or others will not win overseas
because they have not had the training or the understanding of
what is required to Win

I am not saying they dont have the ability, they may well have

Look at recent history No one has done any good overseas because
they have been poorly prepared, again except the likes of AMP.

As for your statement on constructive criticism:- Try this
This all comes back to the facts that we need the State Based Training camps to be up and running to help get people ready and the National representatives need to be in camps with the National coach to learn the stuff they need to know so they have a chance

Yes I am old , as you say, 52 is not that old.
You know what, with respect to that comment you young people, If
that is what you are, could actually learn something from some older
Bowlers, We do have some knowledge you know, we are all
not has been old farts

As for bowling myself I have long term injuries that means I am
unable to compete like i would like too in tourns etc, I do bowl weekly with a 14lb ball these days and still manage 200+ average and have done so for over 25 years, so I am not a mug and I really do know a bit. I owned and run a centre for a few years Have a Level 2 coaching, can drill bowling balls and spent many, many hours of my time to help people

I love Tenpin Bowling, It has been a massive part of my life since I
was 11 years old.
I am not being negative and trying to bag Bowling I am just a firm
believer in credabilty of the game, which i feel we lack.

 

[DrewC]

A little of track of the original question but are the variable and sometimes mandatory tournament patterns killing off the tournaments themselves?

There are factors such as cost of travel etc but these will only generally affect interstate travellers who you need but mostly will still come. I've been in and out of the tournament scene for a few years now but when i started you basically knew what each centre was like before you got there as they all just laid their house shot (generally) whatever it was. This seemed to attract a good deal of locals who figured they stood a chance of making the cut of getting a little money against the travelling players. The locals are the key to high attendance at a tournament thus negating the need to cut prizefunds etc. These guys seemed to have dwindled in numbers state to state over the years since 'we' started mucking around with the lanes (the only exception might be Qld) resulting in tournament participation dropping off and some eventually being cancelled.

My question is do we want to prepare lanes to help potential Aussie reps who in the Adult men for example there might be ten candidates from a field of 100 or do we want to do what we can to get back to attracting the extra 30 odd Vics for example that gets the AO field back to 100?

Scores are just that scores who cares how high or low they are really. It doesn't really impact on the credibility of the sport as much as anyone thinks, just us bowlers demeaning the scores does.

I might be wrong but i think taking the locals shot and by their reckoning their chance of cashing or cutting away is one of the main reasons for the decline in tournament participation.

The guys and gals have won OS because of the hours of work they have put in, not because they won a tournament with a particular pattern on the lanes.

 

[da_cowman]

"Scores are just that scores who cares how high or low they are really. It doesn't really impact on the credibility of the sport as much as anyone thinks, just us bowlers demeaning the scores does."

Best quote of the topic so far. I hope everyone fully understand what is being said there. Kudos Drew.

Cow

 

[chucker]

Look at recent history No one has done any good overseas because
they have been poorly prepared, again except the likes of AMP.

Well Trotts must've been pretty unprepaired and not done any good when he bowled 896 for his first three games of a previous World cup?
Gees he matched up terribly!

 

[cassini]

Mac, it was 898

From what they meant, apart from AMP, none of the men are worth going oversea very sad indeed.

 

[chucker]

No it was definately 896 he left a 7-10 split on the last shot of one game and think by memory a 2-8 on the other game?

 

[Geoff300]

Well Trotts must've been pretty unprepaired and not done any good when he bowled 896 for his first three games of a previous World cup?
Gees he matched up terribly!

Anyone would have to say that is fantastic scoring

You failed to highlight What happened after the first 3 games ?

 

[chucker]

He finished on top of qualifying and match play and lost in the first Tv final.
You dont have to be the winner to have preformed any good as you said overseas?
We have several Men who have won overseas as well surely they must've bowled well and been prepared well? George,Frawls and Belmo?

 

[bluey]

He finished on top of qualifying and match play and lost in the first Tv final.
You dont have to be the winner to have preformed any good as you said overseas?
We have several Men who have won overseas as well surely they must've bowled well and been prepared well? George,Frawls and Belmo?

Hasn't Walshy done well os as well?
I have no doubt that we are a product of our environment, this is true for most if not all league bowlers. The guys mentioned above spent a lot more time on their games than just league. The Pros are not superheroes, they still put their pants on one leg at a time and they do miss. Any of the top guys over here if given the opportunity could mix it with the best. The opportunity to bowl Tournies week after week with little or no other distractions (work) is what makes them better than the rest of us. They weren't born better bowlers than us, they still wipe their own arse, they still have 2 arms and 2 legs. They do have a Pro tour and that is the only difference in where they are in the sport and where we are. So can we prepare ourselves for overseas? Several have done so but the biggest hurdle we face over here isn't ditched or events with 9 300 games, it's financial. The guys listed above did well on the budget they could work with (l believe) except one. Belmo caught someones eye and picked up sponsorship. Now he is a product of a different environment, the environment that we all would love to have. Belmo is now a Pro and will be forever, he wasn't born a Pro but he prepared himself well and got the breaks that are needed to go to the next stage. Others will follow, but only those that can afford it will succeed.

 

[strop]

Totally Agree with you DrewC.

Why cater for the few, numbers are struggling as it is.

We in SA, run by Michael put on sports patterns to try and help bowlers.
Is it working? Unless you bowl more often on these it is quite useless, makes it interesting though, but really doesn't do much else for the amount of times we bowl on it.

Then theres no guarrentee you ever bowl on them again.

Cheers

Tony

 

[jimcross]

Yes, I think it would be a good idea for everyone to read DrewC's post again - carefully - then when you've finished, read it again.

There is a great deal of merit in the way exactly what he describes used to fill Tournt fields,with locals. Then some of those locals would travel to another Tournament, provided it wasn't too far away, and so on.
I hated some of the lane conditions I came across, but in the long run - So What? It didn't stop me, or others, having a go, and, generally speaking, enjoying ourselves.

 

[Bigsy]

I think local handicapped competitions on tough patterns would be a good start. This way, you could generate interest from all age groups and standards. People like myself don't know too much about patterns or PAP's or ditches (Melton still has wooden lanes). I bowl because I enjoy the sport. I bowl 3 games a week and average about 180. Centres and Governing bodies need to get back to the heart of bowling. Get people in leagues and local competitions. Having a handicapped tournament means everyone has a chance, thus, more people show up. Bowl because you enjoy it. I will be trying out for Emerson this year because I think the challenge will be good, but most of all it will be an enjoyable experience, win, lose or draw !!!

My $0.05 + GST

Bigsy...

P.S. - Getting back to original question - You can only prepare so much for a competition, whether it be local, interstate or internationally. At the end of the day, it is YOU that has put the ball on the lane in the right spot. Irrespective of pattern, oil volume or location, consistency is the key and I believe that Australian bowlers are more than capable of holding their own against anybody.

 

[bluey]

Yes, I think it would be a good idea for everyone to read DrewC's post again - carefully - then when you've finished, read it again.

There is a great deal of merit in the way exactly what he describes used to fill Tournt fields,with locals. Then some of those locals would travel to another Tournament, provided it wasn't too far away, and so on.
I hated some of the lane conditions I came across, but in the long run - So What? It didn't stop me, or others, having a go, and, generally speaking, enjoying ourselves.

I believe this is the theory in NQ, house shot, fill the centre mainly with locals. Always worth traveling to these Tournies, always a good tournout.

 

[mickyd213]

Unfortunately, there is VERY little chance this will happen. Bowlers are squealing about having to pay $27.50 for a year.

But they also squeal about paying 10c extra a game when the prices go up but still keep coming back.
Make bowling membership $40-50 for Adults and half that for juniors... People will still complain and the ones that are members now will probably still be members if this happens anyway.

 

[Troyza]

Eh.. If the scoring was hard & low, people would have complained. But when the scoring is higher... wait, people are still complaining?

I'm sure I'm not the only one seeing a pattern here. At the end of the day, every bowler had to bowl on the same condition. If that condition suited ones style more than someone else, then adapt, maybe?? Adjusting is an important part of bowling obviously. Bowlers will always come accross lane conditioning that favors certain players, but that's just their luck, & in this case, the condition suited quite a lot of people.

I think being able to consistantly throw your gear is what makes a bowler, not the scores. But it seems people can't see past them. Consistancy aids scoring, just as oiling does obviously. But if you need to fudge your shot a bit more than normal, or grip it a bit harder, just so you can keep up with the carry contest, it's your job to do it, not the oiling machine. Preparation doesn't really seem like an issue to me, but oh well.

 

[Ubby]

Process > Outcome.
The more you work on your physical AND mental game, the better your performance will be on any given day, on any given pattern.
You can only control what happens until the ball leaves your hand, why concern yourself with aspects that are completely out of your control.
In saying that, the better you execute your shot, the higher chance you have of scoring.

Lets not forget, at the end of the day, knowledge is power.

 

[jimcross]

Most threads on this whole forum, tend towards taking a 'dark' view of things generally ( those to do with actual bowling, that is.) General negativity seems to be more common than bright, optimistic outlooks. Along with this, over the years, it seems to be that bowlers, especially the newer ones, even the genuine high average ones, have at the front of their thinking, that it is equipment, lanes or balls which will decide how good they'll be, in comparison with others. ( here or o/seas )

How good you are at anything, if you think about it, is only by comparison. If you were the only person in the world doing something, and the only one ever to have done it, until and unless someone else took it up, how would anyone know if you were any good at it, or first or second best, etc., etc.

Bit by bit, this thread has started a bit of a miracle, People are pointing out such thimgs as a 205 average winning an event and a 240 average in another putting you among the also-rans, might just have most of the same people in round about the same positions.

Leading to the amazing conclusion that the person makes more difference than the equipment, that maybe we should bowl more tournaments on the normal conditions in that centre, gathering a few more recruits to the tourny scene along the way.

We're even learning, over again, what every top sports person in the world ( yes - EVERY ) has always known, and that is that the mental game beats all other games. Consistantly!!

If you distill all the posts on this thread, in just about every one you'll find something useful, and - miracle - the tone of the thread is actually getting more positive.

If the majority of reasonably serious bowlers supported every event they reasonably could: did it in a positive spirit and only ever made practical and positive suggestions ( critisisms ), it might well become catching - like a virus - and infect others, including organisers. TBA even... If you have the time, read all the posts again, and if you imagine it as a graph, you really will find that the graph is rising.

Positivity is winning !!!!!

My rave for the day. Week?? Month ????

 

[bluey]

Most threads on this whole forum, tend towards taking a 'dark' view of things generally ( those to do with actual bowling, that is.) General negativity seems to be more common than bright, optimistic outlooks. Along with this, over the years, it seems to be that bowlers, especially the newer ones, even the genuine high average ones, have at the front of their thinking, that it is equipment, lanes or balls which will decide how good they'll be, in comparison with others. ( here or o/seas )

How good you are at anything, if you think about it, is only by comparison. If you were the only person in the world doing something, and the only one ever to have done it, until and unless someone else took it up, how would anyone know if you were any good at it, or first or second best, etc., etc.

Bit by bit, this thread has started a bit of a miracle, People are pointing out such thimgs as a 205 average winning an event and a 240 average in another putting you among the also-rans, might just have most of the same people in round about the same positions.

Leading to the amazing conclusion that the person makes more difference than the equipment, that maybe we should bowl more tournaments on the normal conditions in that centre, gathering a few more recruits to the tourny scene along the way.

We're even learning, over again, what every top sports person in the world ( yes - EVERY ) has always known, and that is that the mental game beats all other games. Consistantly!!

If you distill all the posts on this thread, in just about every one you'll find something useful, and - miracle - the tone of the thread is actually getting more positive.

If the majority of reasonably serious bowlers supported every event they reasonably could: did it in a positive spirit and only ever made practical and positive suggestions ( critisisms ), it might well become catching - like a virus - and infect others, including organisers. TBA even... If you have the time, read all the posts again, and if you imagine it as a graph, you really will find that the graph is rising.

Positivity is winning !!!!!

My rave for the day. Week?? Month ????

That's enough of that crap Jim, there's no room in here for your positivity. There MUST be someone or something else to blame, we are all perfect. FIGJAM.

 

[jimcross]

That's enough of that crap Jim, there's no room in here for your positivity. There MUST be someone or something else to blame, we are all perfect. FIGJAM.

Sorry mate. Got carried away. Don't know what came over me. :surrender: