TBA lane conditioning policy?? explain please

[You have been Munsoned]

i have a very simple question

i have just read the policy and low and behold it just does not make sense.

It clearly states:
"The legal lane dressing for Australian centres will be very simple: A
minimum of 5 units of oil edgeboard to edgeboard, present on the
oiled portion of the lane."

but then it goes on to state:
"The average of all three results is to be taken to check compliance. If after the tape is analysed the following results are found:
3 units of oil on the outside boards on lane 4 at 34 feet.
8 units are found on the same boards on lane 6, at the same distance.
4 units are found on the same boards on lane 16, at the same
distance.
This would equal an average of 5 units of oil present on the outside
boards, which would be a complying condition."

So, what this is in effect is saying that the lanes can be inconsistant? and what about the 5 unit MINIMUM????? your now saying that you can have 3 and 4 units. I did alright at school, i graduated high school and tafe, but (and you can correct me if i am wrong) both 3 and 4 come before 5 in the sequences i was taught at school.

does this mean that you can have on the 3 lanes
1 unit
1 unit
13 units.

That equals 15 and divide that by 3 you get 5 units per lane.??

please explain mr frawley i am so so so confused on this.

the document is on display at the tba website if you want to look at it too

roy boy

 

[ms]

Hi Roy boy,

i understand where you are from coming from, but so many people post things on here and expect TBA to reply...

THEY ARE NOT GOING TO!

If you want to know anything at all about everything.... Email TBA direct, or call them. I believe Alex Popov the CEO or Peter Coburn are happy to answer any questions..

I know this is a public forum, but if all we are going to do is bitch and carry on about TBA, the least we can do is go to the sourse direct instead of bitching on here because they will not reply to any posts i dont think..

Cheers,
Yours in bowling
Martina

 

[gardencitylanes]

TBA Lane regulations

Dear Roy boy,

Hi mate. From a bowling centre manager this may help to answer your query. The reason for doing this is to give a tolarance for lane movement and surface deterieration. A lane surface from one end of a house to another will almost certainly never be the same for reasons that would be as long as a piece of string. I am sure you will not get variances of units such as the example you gave. Also something you should realise is a unit of oil is so minute that 1 or 2 units difference will make little difference to your ball reaction.

The ruling was simply put in place to try and prevent centres placing dry board blocks on the outside.I think you will also find that the ruling is only in place for tournaments that are invovled in national ranking points.

As for Frawls, give the guy a break. He does not need to explain anything. Some people will do well to realise that Andrew puts alot of time and knowledge into our sport for little reward and plenty of ass kickings. He does not make things up just to benefit himself which I think some people believe he does. The guy bowls more overseas than here at home and thanks to his travels is merely trying to lift our standards so we as a Nation can continue to compete on the world stage.

Anyway I hope this helps.

Yours in Bowling

Zane Que
Garden City Lanes

 

[You have been Munsoned]

Hi

Zane, you write that 1 or 2 units of oil will make little or no difference to ball reaction, but the reason that the 5 unit rule was brought in was to increase it from the WTBA 3 unit minimum. No if 1 or 2 units wont make much of a difference, why it is only 5 units????

Also, what is stopping the centres that have the Sanction technology machines from loading up the middle of the lanes, you can still create a major block with a ton of oil on the outside, you just have a ton of oil in the middle then.

My main concern was why call it a minimum??? does a bowler that shoots a 300 and then have his ball weighed (say he used 2 balls during the game) get the luxury of having the balls averaged out??? no, the guidlines are stirctly a maximum wieght, so why should this be any different???

If they want to have the lanes averaged out, thats great, but at least word it the way it is supposed to be, not just a major contridiction.

roy boy

 

[GeorgeF]

Comparing rules relating to bowling balls against lane conditions is like comparing chalk and cheese. The main reason why TBA has established this MINIMUM rule is to ensure that centres start putting down oil from edge board to edge board. This rule also comes into line with WTBA regulations which will assist our bowlers in the future at an International level.

Not oiling the edge boards is no good for the sport. I have bowled 3 tournaments in a row in 3 different centres in QLD, including our Queensland Championships and Masters at centres who refuse to put oil on the edge boards. This FREE HOOK does nothing for the sport, encourages no hand releases and most of the time encourages a significant increase in ball speed which means bowlers walk out of the centre with sore shoulders and backs. Its no good for the lanes, no good for the balls or people bowling them. I encourage any measures that TBA put forward to stop these conditions from being put down.

Australia seems to be the only ones left behind. I have never bowled overseas and had free hook or no oil edge boards. Most patterns I have played on through out Europe, Asia and USA are all over 37ft and have oil on 1-3 board at 37ft. By putting oil down on the edge boards it encourages rotation, smooth delivery, consistancy and most importantly ACCURACY. TBA are trying to enforce a MINIMUM standard which will bring us into line with everyone else in the world, which in the future will help our bowlers compete on the International stage.

If bowling centres with Santion technology machines want to put down a lake in the middle and less units on the edge so be it. Some patterns are easier than others just like some golf courses are easier than others as well. Sport bowling is here for the people who want a challenge, maybe even one day all our National events will have sport patterns on them and we'll see how good we really are.

The great thing about sanction technology is that most of the time it allows all bowlers of all styles to have a chance of winning the tournament and scoring. Arafura was a great example of a heavy oil pattern and that was done with an old century. Every board was oiled from edge to edge and yes there was a lake in the middle but the pattern encouraged rotation and consistancy.

I guess what I am trying to say is that no matter where you live or how you bowl you are only a product of your environment. TBA are trying to create a minimum standard environment which in the future will make us all better bowlers. National ranked events are TBA's priority at the moment, I'd expect a solid flow on from there to National, State and local championships in due time.

Your arguement in relation to averaging out units across lanes is lame. It is a small play on words, thats it! You know what TBA are on about, how about we start spreading the word about MINIMUM lane standards instead of reading too much into rules and pieces of paper.

My only concern is forcing the non complying centres to put down oil on the edge boards, I would imagine some of TBA's pleas will be falling on deaf ears I for one hope bowling centre proprietors play by the rules (as most do already).

 

[SNEEZY]

You have been Munsoned

I agree with Zane Que from garden city lanes. Not every lane is exactly the same.

You need to take into account the following when reading those rules. Wear and tear on a lane, the lane may soak up oil more than another, lane traffic - not every lane has the same number of games bowled on them.

Also you should realise that an oiling pattern is only accurate until the first ball has been bowled down the lane. As a lane is bowled on the ball picks up oil and takes it down the lane. Therefore there is a carry down of oil which make the oiling pattern quite different to when it was first laid on the lane by the oiling machine. As a result the difference between one lane to another could be something like 10 to 15 units of oil (for example).

Another point to realise is that although the TBA rules state that you must have a minimum of 5 units of oil on the lane. I think that it is safe to say that any centre you bowl at there would be on average between 10 to 20 units of oil edge board to edge board which is well and truely over the minimum requirement set by the TBA. 8)

 

[wchester]

Another point to realise is that although the TBA rules state that you must have a minimum of 5 units of oil on the lane. I think that it is safe to say that any centre you bowl at there would be on average between 10 to 20 units of oil edge board to edge board which is well and truely over the minimum requirement set by the TBA. 8)

What dream world do you live in?

 

[sandor]

Lack of Oil on Lanes

I have just returned from ATBSO Nationals at Kedron Bowl in Queensland, anyone who bowled there can relate to this topic.

The lack of oil on the lanes for the whole tournament required me to overthrow my dry lane ball from hooking too much and i now have a sore elbow, shoulder and ribs.

This type of lane condition just like the wall block does nothing for bowling.

 

[SNEEZY]

Obviously a more forgiving dreamworld than yours wchester.

The centre I bowl in at one stage had at least 10 units of oil from edge board to edge board. Now it seems like it has 50 units on the outside 5 boards and alot less in the middle of the lane.

The point I was trying to get across was that, to bowl on 5 units of oil would be like bowling on a lane that has no oil as there is vertually nothing on the lane. What would be the point of laying that type of condition when on that type of condition you would vertually have to ditch the ball down the lane and in the end the centre will have a lot of unhappy bowlers including ones with arm or back injuries (and the like).

 

[GeorgeF]

Whilst I hate to agree with Wayne in public I will do so on this occassion. I am yet to find a centre in Australia with 10 units on the edge boards, even centres with Sanction technology. I'm not say its not possible because Cabooltures Sports series tournaments has shown us it is but I would question the accuracy of such a remark.

To take things even further, most patterns around the world are based on 3 things now

* Ratio (oil from middle to edge)
* Length (Length of oil v buff v friction)
* Millilitres (amount of oil being placed on the lane).

The reason we use units is because 95% of the centres dont have Sanction technology and therefor are unable to measure a mL reading. Units an older term which at the moment everyone understands, I'd imagine in the future all measurements will based on the 3 things I listed above with minimum restrictions on all.

Sneezy if you think your local centre is putting down 10 units on the edge and 5 units in the middle can you please tell me how you came to this conclusion and what is a unit in your definition?

 

[Easy Tiger]

I don't know about what condition was set at the ATBSO Nationals at Kedron, I watched but of course I didn't bowl. Kedron now puts more oil down than it used too...at least that's how it appears to me and I have bowled there all year as well as a few occasions last year.

The ATBSO Nationals condition would have been different, I can't say whether it would be dryer or not. But I know I have had to change my shot at Kedron since earlier this year.

 

[GeorgeF]

Timmee no offence but your out of league here, you have no idea what your talking about when it comes down to oil. Kedron uses a pheonix oiling machine and is very limited in its capabilities. It's leauge pattern is extremely short and pathetically dry, its tournament pattern (when they choose to use it, usually on by force or direction) is moderate but still not to the standard that TBA are trying to enforce.

Kedron have never put down enough oil as outlined by TBA in their new guidelines and if they did attempt such a feat they would create the biggest reverse block and out of bounds you have ever seen. I know the machine and its capabilities and have participated in oil testing at Kedron also.

I have no doubts after speaking to some ATBSO people that Kedron put down there league condition which would explain the complaints and sore muscles.

Timmee I don't know who you are but you need to learn more about the game and technology before you participate in discussions such as these. Roy Boy either right or wrong makes some good points, your post did nothing to address the original topic and I feel you lack the experience and knowledge to comment on this issue. Perhaps you should be more selective in your posting instead of posting on every topic you read for the sake of being heard :shock:

 

[Crawf]

Part of gaining experience and understanding of the issue at hand is to comment on it from our perspective. I believe Timmee is only young (about 17 or 18, like myself). Thus, it is likely that he does not have the knowledge to understand this debate to its full extent.

This is why people like yourself are so valuable to this forum, George, as your extensive knowledge base and bowling experience can help younger bowlers gain more of an insight into the technical side of bowling.

I apologise that this posting does not address the topic either, for i too do not have the knowledge to comment. However i think we need to allow younger bowlers a chance to have their say, even if we do need guidance and direction from individuals such as yourself to fill in our overly large knowledge gaps.

i respect you highly as a bowler and an individual, George, so please don't take my comments the wrong way. Best of luck for your remaining tournaments this year!

Ryan Crawford

 

[Easy Tiger]

George,
I respect you and you know a lot about the game and have a lot of knowledge both overseas and at home. You know a lot more than me, no doubt about it. I take no real offence at what you said because I know you have more experience. However, I never said Kedron wasn't a dry centre, I said it was LESS dry than it used to be (not by much though I admit. It is still dry).

Yes the oiling machine is limited in its capabilities (I did know that :? ) I hear that it also broke down during atbso, and that caused problems as well. It is not the first time it has happened just thought I'd add that.

I think to say I know nothing at ALL about oiling is going a little bit far personally... but fair enough I'll accept your opinion.

I have a lot to learn yet about the game and technology, I agree totally. Yes I lack a fair amount of experience, but it's all about learning from others. I am trying to learn as much as I can about the game, because I love it. That's the main reason why I am on here posting at all. I am willing to learn as much as I can about the game from anyone with more experience than me, you included. Hopefully when I have enough knowledge I can help others, I like helping people out because I appreciate what others do for me

 

[*MELIZA*]

i have to say that i agree totally with crawf we need people like u george to help us give us the infomation that will help us not disheart us

just my opinion

mel

 

[bowlrig]

The TBA Lane Conditioning Policy will not work unless it is enforced.
It will never be enforced so why have it?

It is only a suggestion that is used by very few Centres.

 

[Graham]

Kedron uses a pheonix oiling machine and is very limited in its capabilities.

George

I think you will find Kedron uses a Summit

 

[sandor]

Kedron

Re the ATBSO Nationals

The centre did use a summit, 3 of them in fact, I thought the techs did a magnificent job under the circumstances and Maureen and her staff were terrific too

As far as I know the tournament committee was responsible for the tournament condition

 

[USABowlerPennsylvania]

Hmmm

Hmmmmmmm,
George, you alright brotha? No need to be jumpy, as agreeing wif CrawF, we all need some time to experience things, esepcially in this forum man, so we all jsut have to chillllllll, he didnt say anything wrong, jsut made some simple errors, i mean its timmee for cryign out loud!!! MWAHAHHAHAHAHA, j/m j/m Well, not having the tenure to say i bowl in Australia often, i will only say that i doubt the Phoenix has limited functions...All the centres i visit, tournaments and such, they use Phoenix's...ITs a great machine if you program the thing right ey, lol Lets jsut all get along Danny G.......

 

[SNEEZY]

Hi George

In answer to your question, I came to the conclusion that my local centre had 10 units of oil on the edge boards after the head machanic told me such information some time ago. Whether it was accurate or not is another question but I was only going by what I have been told. Currently it is hard to tell what is on the lane as the conditions seem to change from day to day and to look at the print out of what is on the lane is like looking at an erratic heart beat. :?

As to the difinition of a unit. To me it is a measure of the volume of oil that is on the lane. As to how it is measured (in square inches or from board to board??) I don't know, however. I have recently asked this question to the mechanic and haven't been given a clear answer. Also the other question I have asked is how do you determine a oily lane to a dry lane by the number of units of oil. I have been told that there is no set method of doing this, but from my experience and understanding I would believe that anything upto 30 to 40 units of oil would be considered a dry to medium condtion and anything above that would be considered to be an oily or very oily conditon. If you can shed any light on this or let me know where this is explained in more detail then it would be a great help. 8)