Keeping your hand behind the ball.

M

mickyd213

Member
Hi All,

Having recently just getting a camcorder I set about recording my action... Well to say it was an eye opener was an understatement. I never realised how far around the side of the ball I was as well as on top of it. So during my next practice session I set out with the aim of getting my hand to the inside of the ball and my hand somewhat under the ball.

Once again, I recorded my action only to find that my hand was still on the outside of the ball and on top. However, it felt like my hand was where I wanted it to be.

I bowl without a wrist brace and do manage to keep my hand flat (not in the broken position)

The question I have is : Are there any techniques which can be used to train yourself to keep your hand behind the ball (or to the inside of the ball) while not on the lanes?

There are other aspects of my game which I also need to work on but I thought I'd start here...

Here is a link to my action (or lack of) on youtube... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I-ZTwh0isRE
 
I read your post and watched your video. I have two things to say.
One. I enjoyed the sound track, thanks for that.
Two. You talk about being around/over the ball...whatever. It's hard to see your setup in the video, but it looks like you set up this way in the stance.
Three. The Epidemic looks awesome.
Four. I can't count.
 
Hooligan said:
Two. It's hard to see your setup in the video, but it looks like you set up this way in the stance.
Click to expand...

When I set up it actually feels like I am behind the ball but in actual fact I think it's all in my head and I set up the way I bowl. I have tried to over exaggerate my hand position during the set up but as soon as I push away everything reverts to what you see and it is frustrating. I'll keep plugging away at it though.
 
From what I can tell from the video, you are what is called a squeezer. You hand is completely closed after throwing your shot. ( I can't see your follow thru so I can only assume from what I see as your hand comes back down. )You should try to open your hand at release and you'll see vast improvement in your ball roll.
Also to keep from being so much on the side of the ball, tuck your elbow into your stomach in the set-up and try to feel your forearm rubbing against your side during your push-away.

hope this helps..
 
First, I agree about the " squeeze ". Second, The hand position you use is OK anyhow. From that hand position, you can get everything you need to get on the ball at release - even if it's not what the majority of higher ave bowlers do.
Just work on your release - it's very inconsistant, in that it occurs in lots of different positions of your swing. The 'squeeze' grip is probably a lot to blame for this. It makes me wonder about the 'fit' of your drilling. You shouldn't have to cling to a ball that fits properly.
Last - back to Wayne. Look to your follow through. S-M-O-O-T-H and reach out forward with it.

Luck!!
 
Thanks for your reply Jim,

I have always had the problem of grabbing the ball even through juniors... This I think was due to the wrong thumb pitch and also being overspanned... Which relocated the skin off my thumb quite effectively ( 1/4" rev on the thumb) My span now is approx 7/16" shorter and my thumb pitch is now 1/4" fwd with no rubbing or blistering... If I grab at it like I used to I definitely know about it having said that I know I still have a lot of improvement.

My release is still a long way from perfect and looking back the one thing that really hindered me was bowling with a wrist brace after having carpal tunnel operations... I thought by using the brace I would be able to build up slowly then remove it but found that I could bowl but it didn't help with strength, it's been just over 4 months without the brace and feel my wrist still give way but the occurrences are decreasing and my wrist strength is increasing.

I would also like to get my release lower to the lane and have a smoother ball transition but my knee hates me for it.
 
i was told one peice of really simple advice, maybe it'll help you out. when releasing your ball, try & have your thumb point outwards ( at release point... similar to a hitch hikers wave?) you'll probably see immediate results, but it will feel funny for someone who isn't used to being on the inside of their ball. I personally have been on the inside of my ball for a while, this was to help me get out of my ball cleaner though as I had a tendancy to grab, thus go too far around at times.
 
Hi Micky213

Firstly good for you for putting the vid up and asking for help, its great as others can learn from the responces given.

You are releasing it quite high up, next to your left knee rather than beside your sliding right foot.

I always find when i feel as though im coming "over or around" rather than "under and through" that slowing down slightly and ensuring i get a good front leg bend and smooth slide helps bring me lower to the ground allowing a smoother shot and better balance at the foul line. A long time ago (20+ yrs) i remember being asked, "Why are you in such a hurry to stand upright after you bowl?" I didnt have an answer but i learnt that staying solid at the foul line helps create consistency allowing you to alter your starting and finishing position on the approach.

1 Last tip, if you are having trouble slowing down, move up the approach a bit and shorten your first step (thanks Geoff)

Good Luck.
 
Hey Mick,

Haven't seen you bowl @ the VSS sport anymore :) Anyway, dont know if it helps but these are what I can see :

1. You probably walk a bit too straight.
2. At the foul line, after sliding, your right foot somehow tries to turn to the right which makes your body and hip in particular, move to the left to keep yourselve balanced and get in the way of your swinging arm.
Maybe you can work backward ? Try a few stand at the foul line to see which position you can swing your arm freely (and balanced) with the hand behind the ball and work from there ?

Cheers, G.
 
Thanks guys for all the responses so far...

Hi Giao,
I bowled at the Chirnside park tourny but haven't been able to make any others due to shiftwork... Hope to make the next one in November...
 
I have a similar psychological hang up myself.
As I throw the ball, I "feel" that I have a straight wrist throughout my full swing. I start with a straight wrist, I don't feel that I change it but I am told that I have quite a dramatic cupping action.
On occasion, the action you have there is the action I am actually trying to achieve, it will help me send the ball a bit longer ... me thinks.
Maybe a coach would be helpful for both of us!
 
G'Day Micky,

You come around the ball because you start with it that way. The only way to turn the release into the direction you want the ball to go is to turn further. You're doing the right thing, just starting from the wrong spot! :)

So start with your hand under the ball, like this guy...
Norm Duke 300 Game 2009 USBC Masters Video by stormbowling.com - Myspace Video

Having your hand open will allow you to keep your swing in closer to your body, giving you greater leverage over the ball. You want that heavy ball under you so it swings in line with you, not beside you, swinging you in line with it! You can only beat gravity and momentum for so long!

Then close the release at the bottom of the swing. If you watch Norm Duke very closely, you will see that his hand is behind the ball until it passes his hip. Still he can hook it from the gutter on the USBC Masters pattern, similar to our Nationals Pattern in length and volume. No big rev rate, no magic and using razor sharp holes in the ball so he can't grab it. Simply good timing and swing mechanics. If you want a great lefty example, look at Parker Bohn or Rich Wolfe. Both these guys release the ball magnificently, staying under it until the ball passes their hip.

Then, as Wayne, Jim and Ash have said, ease up your grip, reach long through the release and get your thumb outward, as if hitch hiking. (Thanks Ash for remembering that one!) It's USBC Coach Susie Minshew's tip that I use a lot!

Back to work now.

Cheers,
Jason

p.s. Every great player has a coach. Some, like Chris Barnes, have more than one. A good coach is nearly always a better investment than a new ball. You just need to find a good one who's got time! And that's the tricky bit.
 
Thanks for the link Jason...

Great advice and now to actually get out there and practice it. This is just out of interest and I feel I may already know the answer but seeing how my release has been referred to as a "sqeezer" once I get out of this habit, initially will it feel like I am dropping the ball? Only asking so I have some idea of the feeling I am looking for with a more relaxed shot.
 
If you feel like you're dropping the ball, you've still not got it right. Span, hole pitches - Anyone thinking that getting them totally right is easy, is more than a little misguided. It is a very expert job for the ball driller, combined with good communication. Also, at least consider not using 'lifters'. In my view they're generally just an easy way to get your finger grip somewhere about right.
Precisely shaped holes to your individual fingers, I think is the way to go. Probably most people would disagree with that - but--.

Nothing, in my view, in the whole sequence of bowling a ball, is more important that the actual moment of the ball coming off the fingers, and plain, accurate finger holes give consistancy to this. Rave over now..........
 
jimcross said:
If you feel like you're dropping the ball, you've still not got it right. Span, hole pitches - Anyone thinking that getting them totally right is easy, is more than a little misguided.
Click to expand...

Hi Jim,

I don't drop the ball I was just asking about the feeling I would expect from having a relaxed thumb at the point of release. But I agree there is no substitute for a correctly fitted and drilled ball.
 
Hi Micky, when you get it right, it will almost feel like you have no thumb in the ball. Practice rolling the ball in your lounge room with no fingers in the holes. You'll need to do a little two handed thing to get a backswing of sorts. Make it go forward quickly and silently (no thud). When you can do this, you'll be getting close.

To really understand it, buy Norm Duke's "How to Bowl Competitively" DVD, where he explains this drill. That DVD is worth ten times the asking price IMO and better value than any new ball ever.
 
Troyza said:
i was told one peice of really simple advice, maybe it'll help you out. when releasing your ball, try & have your thumb point outwards ( at release point... similar to a hitch hikers wave?) you'll probably see immediate results, but it will feel funny for someone who isn't used to being on the inside of their ball. I personally have been on the inside of my ball for a while, this was to help me get out of my ball cleaner though as I had a tendancy to grab, thus go too far around at times.
Click to expand...

I agree with this, if you want to get our quicker you need to get your thumb whole tighter. Best way to practise is to do this: Instead of gripping and squeezing the ball like you used to, do the exact opposite. That is push your hand and fingers outwards in the ball. Thumb push out and fingers push out and your hand should be open when you let go of the ball. Some people can do this push all the way from the start of the push away and some like me relax and then only do the push out when they about to release the ball. Its a good drill and will help you get a feel for the ball. Of course it will also tell you if your thumb whole is not tight enough. If it falls off your hand or feels like falling off then tighten it up!
 
Thread Bump#

Have had some coaching recently about working the inside of the ball. It feels so weird especially when I was working the outside for so long. Haven't quite nailed it yet as ive lost a bit of my arc instead got more of a forward roll, this release though has helped me slow my ball speed by about 4 km/ph and my swing feels more relaxed so i'm starting to see the benefits , mentally retraining the brain is the next challenge.
 
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