How many members do you see TBA getting next year?
- Thread starter GeorgeF
- Start date
probably the same person that did the budgeting for Steve Bracks!!!
Andrew S.
Gold Coast
Wow - after all these years you finally discovered the spell check...
In order to make these drastic changes, they will probably need the members in order to achieve a cash flow that will enable them to do what they need to do. Catch 22 isn't it?
It's a new TBA. As far as I can see they are trying damn hard to make a difference. But everything that they come up with is never good enough. Why can't we just give them a chance. Pay the membership for a year. It's a small gamble isn't it? Most people happily throw away more money on gambling, smokes and alcohol in one night. Take one night off that stuff and give TBA a chance. If nothing happens with their new plans this year then fine, keep moaning and all the other [insert your word/s of choice here] that people keep saying. But don't write them off before you've even given them a chance.
These things take time. I know it's hard to believe in this day and age. But they do. So give them a chance. I can't believe how many people have come on and just blatantly written them off already.
One year. Pay your membership. Encourage others in your league to pay the membership, and let TBA do what they are supposed do. At least this way, we actually know what would have happened.
Now, go ahead and blast me for sticking up for TBA.
Cow
I give them 6 months before they go to the ABPA asking for yet another bail out
jockey
Member
It's hard to give them a chance when the plans they have implemented for this year are obviously flawed and show a lack of understanding of the actual Tenpin bowling market here.
As to encouraging others to pay up their membership I'm afraid I would need to be looking over my shoulder after they do so. So I will pay up and leave others to make their own decisions.
Gail Torrens
Member
I think we are throwing out the baby with the bathwater - TBA is the tenpin bowling representative on the Australian and World stage - The sport IS TBA - I do not know about anyone else but I think our sport deserves to be backed in strength by all bowlers who want our sport to be something amongst other sports - if we all stand united with voting with our dollars to pay a small probably 5% of what other members of other sports pay our sport would be able to support most of the wish list we would like to see materialise. If paying $55 gets our sport on a better start than ever before - I am paying. I know before some bad decisions in the past were made - but numbers become strength - I think 60000 is a good starting goal - I would think at least this number of bowlers love the sport! Qld had 20,000 registered bowlers alone in the past - I know this for a fact - as a bowler we can decide to be part of the problem so things remain the same perpetuating no growth and show the ASC that our sport does not deserve inclusion at the level of other sports if growth is the measuring stick - or we can be part of the solution and back the sport we love. Simple.
Merry Christmas everyone - have a great 2009.
Best wishes
Gail
Merry Christmas everyone - have a great 2009.
Best wishes
Gail
well said gail i agree but i do think that tba should have local associations go to leagues and centres to explain things in person, we as competative players know the reasons for agoverning body but your everyday league players dont they only know that tba is the name of the place where they send their sanction fees each year and wonder why they go up in price, anyhow this is taking me forever to type so ill say goodbye and merry xmas to all you chuckers out there. OTTY.
Andrew S.
Gold Coast
I agree its very important to support our National body if we need the sport to progress. Our local Association at Ashmore has over 1100 registered members and our committee will be encouraging them all to continue to support their NSO.
Certainly there will be grumbles and winges about price rises - this happens every year. However when it comes time to pay up I dont think we have lost more than a handful of members over the past few years because of price rises.
Having said that though, the single biggest area of criticism from our League Secretaries turns out to be the new registration process.
Comments ranged from 'What idiot came up with this' to 'A disaster waiting to happen'.
There are still no banking details if registration is performed online and over worked secretaries will in many cases have to collect 2 separate lots of money - 1 to go to the NSO and the other to go to the Local Association who may well offer benefits costing more than the TBA local rebate.
There are also Ranked events in January and it will be interesting to see how the TDs will check for membership registration with this new system.
It would have made more sense to introduce this process mid-year so that any teething troubles could be sorted with a minimum of grief.
As stated originally, we will continue to support TBA, however I would ask that if in future they consider major changes to existing procedues they at least consult with some people who know something about the way things happen.
Certainly there will be grumbles and winges about price rises - this happens every year. However when it comes time to pay up I dont think we have lost more than a handful of members over the past few years because of price rises.
Having said that though, the single biggest area of criticism from our League Secretaries turns out to be the new registration process.
Comments ranged from 'What idiot came up with this' to 'A disaster waiting to happen'.
There are still no banking details if registration is performed online and over worked secretaries will in many cases have to collect 2 separate lots of money - 1 to go to the NSO and the other to go to the Local Association who may well offer benefits costing more than the TBA local rebate.
There are also Ranked events in January and it will be interesting to see how the TDs will check for membership registration with this new system.
It would have made more sense to introduce this process mid-year so that any teething troubles could be sorted with a minimum of grief.
As stated originally, we will continue to support TBA, however I would ask that if in future they consider major changes to existing procedues they at least consult with some people who know something about the way things happen.
jockey
Member
OTTY: The problem here lies in the fact the local association TBA refers to is in fact referring to the bowling centres. AMF has stated to TBA point blankly that they will not be a fee collector for them and the fact AMF have fully suported the MTBA and CTBAM in Melbourne tends to inform me that the TBA is not even close to being in touch with the real bowling reality out there.
With that in mind do you think the bowling centre is going to waste time and people resources explaining to people that already turn up in their centre regularly about an organisation that quite frankly the bowling centre does not give a toss about (to put it frankly), I don't think they will.
Gail: I understand your view on things, as you have been a long time servant of the TBA. However the reality is that the TBA in not in touch with the reality of not only the current Australian bowling communities needs and wants, but also not in touch with simple economics which unfortunately for them the majority of bowlers are (and this is true no matter what the current economic climate as people don't pay up money for nothing in general).
The bowlers know when the figures don't add up, and that is the view, that the majority of once a week bowlers are taking. The reality is that the majority of them don't care about a national body (frankly most didn't even know they had one) but they do care about the services that are provided to them in return for the money they pay to sanction / register each year. The majority that I have spoken and provided an explanation of the break down of fees and also about the non recognition of both the MTBA and CTBAM for affiliation have said point blankly: why do we need them as they don't provide me with anything. This is the attitude TBA has generated from what clearly appears to be a cost structure for 2009 that was poorly presented and not well researched. I also agree with the earlier post that it may have been implemented prematurely and should have been delayed until into the middle of the year to allow for a better package to be established.
The bottom line is our sport is now in trouble due to the instability and utter confusion that the 2009 fee structure has and is bound to cause.
In closing I put this to the TBA that we are all out here and although we post on this open forum I'm sure we are all very willing to contribute time and other resources if we can through the right channels to help our sport progress if we are asked to.
All the majority of bowlers want is a model that works for all of us and unfortunately for the 24 years I've been involved in bowling I have yet to see it although we have got close in recent years but now the promise has dissappeared like a number of other things including some bowlers.
In posting this I sincerely wish all the current TBA stakeholders a happy holiday season and hope that they can come up with a better plan to help Ten Pin Bowling move forward beyond 2009. I also hope that enough people do pay up in order to provide enough funds to allow this to happen.
With that in mind do you think the bowling centre is going to waste time and people resources explaining to people that already turn up in their centre regularly about an organisation that quite frankly the bowling centre does not give a toss about (to put it frankly), I don't think they will.
Gail: I understand your view on things, as you have been a long time servant of the TBA. However the reality is that the TBA in not in touch with the reality of not only the current Australian bowling communities needs and wants, but also not in touch with simple economics which unfortunately for them the majority of bowlers are (and this is true no matter what the current economic climate as people don't pay up money for nothing in general).
The bowlers know when the figures don't add up, and that is the view, that the majority of once a week bowlers are taking. The reality is that the majority of them don't care about a national body (frankly most didn't even know they had one) but they do care about the services that are provided to them in return for the money they pay to sanction / register each year. The majority that I have spoken and provided an explanation of the break down of fees and also about the non recognition of both the MTBA and CTBAM for affiliation have said point blankly: why do we need them as they don't provide me with anything. This is the attitude TBA has generated from what clearly appears to be a cost structure for 2009 that was poorly presented and not well researched. I also agree with the earlier post that it may have been implemented prematurely and should have been delayed until into the middle of the year to allow for a better package to be established.
The bottom line is our sport is now in trouble due to the instability and utter confusion that the 2009 fee structure has and is bound to cause.
In closing I put this to the TBA that we are all out here and although we post on this open forum I'm sure we are all very willing to contribute time and other resources if we can through the right channels to help our sport progress if we are asked to.
All the majority of bowlers want is a model that works for all of us and unfortunately for the 24 years I've been involved in bowling I have yet to see it although we have got close in recent years but now the promise has dissappeared like a number of other things including some bowlers.
In posting this I sincerely wish all the current TBA stakeholders a happy holiday season and hope that they can come up with a better plan to help Ten Pin Bowling move forward beyond 2009. I also hope that enough people do pay up in order to provide enough funds to allow this to happen.
Gail Torrens
Member
Good points presented - I think with the comments so far that have been presented is the recognition that the coal face general member services are provided by the local association - and the sport service support (which includes accreditation of coaches and formation of committees to provide services to junior and youth development - our future) are provided initially by junior coordinators at bowling centres and generally by the State and National body. How many services does the local association offer to bowlers - do they have enough skilled persons on their committee to provide what the bowlers need? Do they have more people critiquing than assisting - volunteers are the lifeblood of our sport. I would not be involved in this sport if not for an elderly gentleman by the name of Alan McKenzie who volunteered to serve the sport and who convinced me this was the best sport in the world. He simply had a chat with me one day while doing his volunteer work.
The big picture of sport is the unseen chapters of building the sport - such things as talent ID processes which are backed by R & D (Research and Development) which in turn builds training and support systems for the aspiring to elite and elite bowlers of our country). Exposure of our sport at all primary and High schools is another way and is being done in Qld (40,000 juniors were taught tenpin in schools in 2008 ) of expanding the reach of our sport -The building of these sport services is unseen - but effective to the community - big picture stuff. I do not know about the struggle in Victoria with the associations please excuse my lack of knowledge on this but I am sure all parties want the sport to be strong and this is common ground - I believe you get good people in each centre and we all agree that we all are able to provide services but which services? Too many representative bodies providing the same sport services only fractures our strength as a sport - more representative bodies who provide specific sport services under one umberalla is the way to go.
We need affiliation with the Australian representative of our sport to provide the unseen sport development ongoing year in and year out consisitently. TBA are selling a future one step at a time - if they are not in touch they need persons input who believe in what they are saying. Offer on the TBA website (look to current months news) currently for persons to be involved in several National sub committees - this is an opportunity to deliver input on the real situation as many see it and be part of the change. www.tenpin.org.au
TBA take membership on line in January - easy. In the short term pay your local TBA representative - Player insurance is a worthwhile inclusion in the 2009 package - I do not know any other tenpin body who can offer this in their membership.
Gail
The big picture of sport is the unseen chapters of building the sport - such things as talent ID processes which are backed by R & D (Research and Development) which in turn builds training and support systems for the aspiring to elite and elite bowlers of our country). Exposure of our sport at all primary and High schools is another way and is being done in Qld (40,000 juniors were taught tenpin in schools in 2008 ) of expanding the reach of our sport -The building of these sport services is unseen - but effective to the community - big picture stuff. I do not know about the struggle in Victoria with the associations please excuse my lack of knowledge on this but I am sure all parties want the sport to be strong and this is common ground - I believe you get good people in each centre and we all agree that we all are able to provide services but which services? Too many representative bodies providing the same sport services only fractures our strength as a sport - more representative bodies who provide specific sport services under one umberalla is the way to go.
We need affiliation with the Australian representative of our sport to provide the unseen sport development ongoing year in and year out consisitently. TBA are selling a future one step at a time - if they are not in touch they need persons input who believe in what they are saying. Offer on the TBA website (look to current months news) currently for persons to be involved in several National sub committees - this is an opportunity to deliver input on the real situation as many see it and be part of the change. www.tenpin.org.au
TBA take membership on line in January - easy. In the short term pay your local TBA representative - Player insurance is a worthwhile inclusion in the 2009 package - I do not know any other tenpin body who can offer this in their membership.
Gail
All this bull**** about people paying extra in fees is just that. Noone has said they don't want to pay more. What people are saying is they want the sport promoted properly, run properly and they want to actually get something for their money. This could be as simple as a better run sport or as hard to manage as rewards systems.
Personally I don't blame centres if they refuse to collect revenue for TBA. The TBA is an organisation using someone else's facilities to run their business. They should collect their own fees and should organise ways to do it without expecting 3rd parties (proprietors) to do things.
Player insurance : I have bowled for 20 or so years and have yet to see someone taken to hospital or seriously hurt (apart from a broken toe I got when someone dropped a ball on it).
I have a suggestion. We get rid of:
1. All the accusations.
2. The past good/bad deeds.
3. The people trying to "look good".
4. All the little glossy things that are not required.
5. The person who does a budget for TBA based on obviously unrealistic numbers.
We need to get back to the basics, get a cash flow (whether it be raising fees or not), and get the sport moving. If there are other issues, and I am sure there are, then we need to address them.
ALL associations need to answer to a single National body (TBA or not). If this upsets some of the associations then so be it.
Proprietors are often very good allies in local associations (our local association is a great example of this) but I also think we need to have associations that are independent of the facility itself. Nothing against the proprietors but this would result in associations that truly represent the bowlers which doesnt happen in some centres from what I hear.
We need to keep it simple.
We need to move forward, not dwell in the past.
We need to sort out the issues and not the rumours.
People have been asking for suggestions instead of complaints. There it is whether you like it or not.
Personally I don't blame centres if they refuse to collect revenue for TBA. The TBA is an organisation using someone else's facilities to run their business. They should collect their own fees and should organise ways to do it without expecting 3rd parties (proprietors) to do things.
Player insurance : I have bowled for 20 or so years and have yet to see someone taken to hospital or seriously hurt (apart from a broken toe I got when someone dropped a ball on it).
I have a suggestion. We get rid of:
1. All the accusations.
2. The past good/bad deeds.
3. The people trying to "look good".
4. All the little glossy things that are not required.
5. The person who does a budget for TBA based on obviously unrealistic numbers.
We need to get back to the basics, get a cash flow (whether it be raising fees or not), and get the sport moving. If there are other issues, and I am sure there are, then we need to address them.
ALL associations need to answer to a single National body (TBA or not). If this upsets some of the associations then so be it.
Proprietors are often very good allies in local associations (our local association is a great example of this) but I also think we need to have associations that are independent of the facility itself. Nothing against the proprietors but this would result in associations that truly represent the bowlers which doesnt happen in some centres from what I hear.
We need to keep it simple.
We need to move forward, not dwell in the past.
We need to sort out the issues and not the rumours.
People have been asking for suggestions instead of complaints. There it is whether you like it or not.
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