What are the best/worst things about Australian Bowling.

S

Showboat

Like the heading says above, what are you personal favourite things about the sport in Oz, and what are the things that you think could be improved to make it bettter?

Please, don't make this a thread about lane conditions, they're too easy, this centre doesn't have a Kegel, that centre has dry boards outside 5 etc etc......... :roll:

Lets have a look at a few other aspects of the sport, do we think it will ever go back to the way it was, or are we banging our heads against a brick wall trying to do things for the sport.
Interested in your thoughts.
 
I think that the biggest problem is that bowling isn't regarded as a sport, more so than a recreational activity. Attracting open bowlers and neglecting league bowlers appears to be the focus, at least that is what I'm seeing.

The main difference I see is "availability." Less coaches, less youth participation/leagues, less good pro shops, less equipment available for a reasonable price. Don't get me wrong, demand drives the prices, but it is now cheaper to get equipment from the overseas, so why doesn't that have any impact on prices locally? Local distributors have to get it from somewhere right?

Depending on where you go, maintenance, or the lack thereof, is also an issue. Noone wants to bowl at a place, if they can help it of course, that destroys their equipment. You've paid your hard earned dollars on a new ball, only to have it chewed up and spit back out at you everytime you go to bowl. It's completely out of your control, and when you report something like that, most of the time it's just a lip service "yeah we'll get right on it." I don't like to be forced into resurfacing when I shouldn't have to. Far wear and tear is excuseable, but accelerated wear and tear due to lack of maintenance is not.
 
Hey all,
This is what I think is the problem going round with bowling well I know it is at my centre. There is no control of what goes on in the players area people miss a spear and start swearing, throwing there equipment (there have been cases where people have been hit by this air born equipment) also when there is a complaint put in nothing is done by it there have been mummeries case's put in about these two bowlers that just happen to run the bowl and one be on the board so when ever there has been a complaint in about them it never gets followed up for example this is one of the worst things I have ever seen happen in a tournament one of these bowlers was red carded by a official out of this centre and is rather high up on the VTBA board and it was over ruled or thrown out the window I should say because the people that run the bowl weren't happy with I mean seriously if something like that doesn't get looked into there is something really wrong and at the moment someone has got a complaint in for them and it will be followed up because it isn't one of those two certain bowlers when they have coursed more trouble than anyone else. The way I see it and this isn't a personal dig at anyone don't take me wrong but that's why bowling in Australia is struggling because there is no control over what the bowlers do well I know this is the case in the centre I bowling in, No body wants to come back to a place where all they can hear and see is abuse of equipment and people.

Thanks I know this is a bit off track but I would like to know if anyone has any suggestions
 
Interesting question actually, I remember seeing another thread somewhere, sometime ago asking pretty much the same thing, I can't be bothered looking at the moment.

Just looking through the last two posts made here, there seems to be some quite valid points raised in relation to some of the reasons why the sport, as such, isn't taken as seriously as it perhaps should be.

I see politics as a pivotal reason for the sport going through somewhat of a "rut" in recent times in all facets of the sport - not just juniors.
Most new bowlers play the game because they want something to do during the week, a "release" from the pressures of work if you understand what I'm saying - the last thing these new players want to have to put up with is, bitching, whingeing and politics.
I have seen situations over the years in regard to this which has really made leagues VERY unpleasant and uncomfortbale to bowl in due to "infighting".

I believe the cost is another problem, wether we like it or not, the fact is, bowling - if you are going to take it seriously - is one of the most expensive sports around.
I find the pricing structure to be a bit of an embarassment in some ways - try telling a man on the phone that for him and his wife and two kids to have a couple of games of bowling - it will cost him $52 :oops: Then hold the phone away from your ear for a few seconds if you are sensitive to bad language :lol:

I realise centres do need to make money to survive and indeed prosper, and, I can't blame them for that, but I've always felt that, if you want to get more people involved, you need to make things more affordable.
It appears to me these days that bowling is more like going to the movies. You've got your nice little snack bar with over inflated prices serving you all the popcorn and coke and "fries" (another American term) you could want.
Centres used to be for bowlers when I first started, these days that's not quite so.

I believe "quasi2k" raised the point on decrepit centres in his/her post - I am not allowed to comment on that for private reasons, but let me says this, yes it does make all the difference.

"Saleboy" comments on bowlers behaviour being a problem - I think you are quite right - personally Ive done things, and yelled language that I'm not exactly proud of over the years.
I agree that perhaps a National Code of Conduct would be better being brought in rather than leaving it as a localised affair.
Trouble is, how do you police it???

What may be a joking "F**k" to one person maybe considered a "hangable offence" to another person and, you get all sorts of problems of bias in the judging of these things.
A league initiated behavioural code was bought in at Moonah in 1997 - courtesy of a growing number of complaints in leagues by mostly elderly bowlers about the growing problem of foul language and some rowdy behaviour, by bowlers partaking in alcoholic beverages - this lead to all sorts of problems.
There were allegations of bias toward certain people, allegations of specific bowers being targeted, whilst misdomeaners of other players were completely ignored - it became farcical and was eventually let go after an unsavoury incident in a league, basically split the league in two, when they were called to act as "jury members" - patently absurd - eventually more the 40% of those bowlers quit the league.
I've never had a problem with bowlers dropping the odd bit of fruity language, or whacking a chair in disgust, all bowlers are human beings after all :roll:
When the mark is overstepped somewhat, then sort it out.

With a common sense approach the game can come back in this country, most definately.
Now it's off to find the common sense.......................... :shock:
 
saleboy....You may or may not have made a valid point in your post.
However, without punctuation..I CAN'T MAKE HEADS OR TAILS OF IT.

Wayne
 
Many thanks for the responses so far, all have raised some good points, lets hear some more
Just off topic for a sec here - TIGER - I see your location is listed as North Hobart.
I bowled in the '83 Championships in Tassie and the wife and I stayed in a motel in North Hobart actually, it was on the edge of a highway on the outskirts of the town up a hill behind the local football ground and mental institute if i remember rightly.
No disrespect intended here but from my memories of visiting there it was a very grimy dirty old town back then, very run down and bleek looking, smoky, cold and rained all the time, it reminded me a hell of a lot of Manchester or Birmingham or Bradford or Liverpool in England, has the place changed much since then?
I also remember being accosted by some of the locals there back then, they were rather odd to say the least.... :lol: Most were drunk as skunks from memory from a pub called the Empire Hotel, crikey that was a rough joint :lol:
Wouldn't mind getting back to Tassie some day to see it again.
 
one thing i can definately see is wrong with bowling is lack of education about the sport, education to the general public, the "social bowlers of leagues", and your competetive bowlers like those who bowl shield rachuig etc. my point is here alot of tv ads do wonders for drawing attention to the general public for it being a fun"outing" for the family. these are great for that side of the sport and are fine, but i reckon we should also have some of the more "recognised" bowlers being on some of these ads showing the public what our sport really is about. and also how many juniors do you see that go through their junior years and are extremely talented bowlers or have so much potential its not funny, and when they are too old for jnuiors quit. its largely due to the fact that they still really dont know what they could actually achieve in the sport but also to do with what tiger said....politics.... alot of juniors tell me they wont bowl after juniors because they hate the "bitching". In my point of view, most of these cases thats a load of crap, some juniors wont continue on because they know that it gets ALOT harder for them to compete well and arent prepared to put in the hard yards, what i am trying to say in all this rambling is, that we need to guide from a junior level(and also adult) people into wanting to take on the bigger challenges instead of going stuff it its too hard. we need mroe people out there sharing their knowledge to try and keep what base of bowlers we have going, and if they stay in the sport then those bowlers can do the same to the next generation and so on and so on. i personally think ideas like the tba camp, and especially the honeychurch camp are a fantasit idea and are going to do wonders dfor the sport, but i think there needs to be a camp(s) that is open to all ages, so its available to everyone, cause i knw alot of people that are older than 18 that would have killed to go to any of these camps but because they were too old couldnt. maybe that could be something that could be looked into, maybe trying to organise a honeychurch like camp for all ages.
 
TIGER said:
I've never had a problem with bowlers dropping the odd bit of fruity language, or whacking a chair in disgust, all bowlers are human beings after all :roll:

Well you couldn't get upset at people doing the same things as you could ya Matt :lol: jk.

Steptoe said:
I also remember being accosted by some of the locals there back then, they were rather odd to say the least.... Most were drunk as skunks from memory from a pub called the Empire Hotel, crikey that was a rough joint

One of those locals was probably Matty :wink:
BTW the Empire in it's old form doesn't exist anymore - it's cleaned up it's act. :)
 
Steptoe said:
TIGER - I see your location is listed as North Hobart.
I bowled in the '83 Championships in Tassie and the wife and I stayed in a motel in North Hobart actually, it was on the edge of a highway on the outskirts of the town up a hill behind the local football ground and mental institute if i remember rightly.
No disrespect intended here but from my memories of visiting there it was a very grimy dirty old town back then, very run down and bleek looking, smoky, cold and rained all the time, it reminded me a hell of a lot of Manchester or Birmingham or Bradford or Liverpool in England, has the place changed much since then?
I also remember being accosted by some of the locals there back then, they were rather odd to say the least.... :lol: Most were drunk as skunks from memory from a pub called the Empire Hotel, crikey that was a rough joint :lol:
Wouldn't mind getting back to Tassie some day to see it again.

No offence taken, having grown up and still living in the area, the place was commonly known as an absolute dump.
Basically the place hadn't changed at all since the 1880's and looked pretty much like that English TV show - Coronation Street.

It has changed quite a bit since your visit, the mainland developers came down in the late '80's and early '90's and completely redeveloped much of the area.
The main street, has seen much of this redevelopment, many of the old rat-infested shops have been pulled down and rebuilt, the old bank has been demolished as well, some places have been burnt down and rebuilt.

From your description, the place you and your wife would have stayed at, sounds like the Tower Motel on Park Street - which is still there.
The Football Oval has barely changed, a brand new stand was built after the old one burned to the ground, and the old Blind, Deaf and Dumb Institute closed in the late '80's - this is now a luxury apartment/accomodation/Function Centre called Northside Manor.

The area still has pockets of heavy industrial business, but, that is decreasing by the year, with mainland investors keen to scoop up whatever land they can get thier hands on, as the land prices soar to record levels.

Most of the houses have been given makeovers too, even ours had a paint a few years ago for the first time since before World War 2 :lol:

The pubs are all still there, a couple have had name changes but, have dramatically changed in clientele over the years, as this area is getting more yuppified :x
I see you drank at the old Empire Hotel - you couldn't have picked a worse pub to down a few at.
That place always had a history of trouble, and was eventually closed down about six or seven years ago after a shootout between bikies and pimps in the main bar.
After it was reopened it was called the Republic Bar and, now has greenies, yuppies, uni types, and intellectuals drink in it - I went there once - took one look and walked out again.

The whole vibe of the area has changed almost completely, in recent years but on the whole it is a much nicer place than it was back then.

The only things that haven't changed are the weirdos still hang around the place, shower once every 2-3 years and walk around in circles on the footpath having conversations with themselves :lol:
Per head of population, this area would have more weirdo's about than Kings Cross.
And the other constant is that, it is cold as hell in winter, always wet, windy and bleek, but the summer-time is always very warm.

Hope that helps Steptoe :wink:
 
Ok my 2 bobs worth. In my opinion we will always need to focus just as much attention on the recreactional side of bowling aswell as the competitive because lets face it.. if the people don't get down there for a couple of fun games how will they ever decide. Yes of recent we have seen many boutique centres open up focusing on social only with no leagues and that is just as common as a swimming pool opening up and not being exclusively for competitive swimmers.
I am pleased to see of late more focus on the needs of Youth bowlers with the introduction of Youth Leagues in centres and more Youth Tournaments each year. Hopefully this will be on the increase so as we can help our juniors with their transition into the adults rank of bowling.
Yes it is true that the lane conditions matter and you may find that city centres are often in a better position than country centres to afford to maintain their lanes. Demographics unfortunately control this.
In regards to coaches, if you ask around there is always someone, be it staff or mate, willing to give a hand if asked. As for the needs of high performance bowlers there are specialists available but as for any sport they are usually city based and also few.
Yes its true that at the moment buying over the net direct from USA many proshop items are considerably cheaper due to the conversion rate of the dollar. Currently there is not a great supply of high performance items because of this.
Bad sportsmanship is always detrimental to the sport and should not be tolerated at any level. Its ok to show some sort of frustration but keep your hands and feet to yourself and a civil tongue.
Politics is and will always be a sore point. Just as the problems with any other sport, or local and federal govts for that matter, none will ever get it right. But with bowlers speaking up through the proper channels things can and will change eventually as they have from years gone by.
As for bowling being one of the most expensive sports around I beg to differ. About 45% of a centres bowlers use house gear, 45% buy their own gear (roughly costing $230 for ball bag and shoes which can last from 5 to 10yrs) and the rest use high performance gear which could reach into the thousands. Game cost is reasonable with $15- being the average league 3 game cost. For this price you can have up to two hours of pleasure during which you are participating in a sport and getting excercise, making conversation with teammates and opponents, and maybe even enjoying a coke or a capuccino. And with such a level playing field where you can have several generations in the same family playing together. I can't think of any other sports that could suit as many people at one time as bowling does.
Now if you are not enjoying your bowling do something about it.
If and when there are situations you are not comfortable with be it bad behaviour, poor conditions, bad politics etc, approach centre management and discuss this at the right time and with the right people. If there is no resolution you may be able to change to another centre if you wish to continue bowling.
Bowling in Australia is seeing new faces amongst the old ones and together with the fact that we are keeping up on an International level 'Bowling in Australia' will not be left behind.
Phew .... didn't realise I had such a long opinion .... haha.
Sorry to bore you all but that's my opinion only and in finishing SALEBOY ... although I did have to read your post twice I do believe you are entitled to post here so please don't be offended by knockers picking on your level of literacy because they often have a very small brain.

:D :D Take a deep breath ..... oops!!!! :oops: :oops:
 
My good mate scoreggia said
Sorry to bore you all but that's my opinion only and in finishing SALEBOY ... although I did have to read your post twice I do believe you are entitled to post here so please don't be offended by knockers picking on your level of literacy because they often have a very small brain.


Let's see..
scoreggia says they had to read saleboy's post twice to comprehend what was written..yet I'm in the shits again for saying virtually the same thing.
Go figure!

scoreggia...Oh, and by the way...keep the personal attacks to yourself or risk a lawsuit ( there's the American in me coming out)

:lol: :lol:
 
Seems aussies have caught the litigous bug too, so it's no longer just an american anomaly.

Another thing that may be missing is monte carlo bowling. Everything seems to get better when money's involved. Also ball leagues where you bowl the season and recieve either a free plastic ball of your choice of a voucher towards the purchase of a higer performance ball. Helps bring in those that may want to try league bowling, or possibly more experienced bowlers just looking for a non open bowling atmosphere to get some practice and get new equipment too.
 
Wonder how many distributors/pro shops in this country would get behind handing out performance gear in this way (C'mon everybody-join our "Battle for a Buzzsaw" leauge!!!) Might cost a few dollars but the cherry(bomb!) at the end would be worth it.
 
Well, what i don't like about bowling in austalia is, AMF!!
They are a major company, and i do respect them, however, they have screwed up a really good bowling centre :cry:
Ive been bowling now for 12yrs at Redcliffe, Qld. The centre was privately owned and run by the Souris family, and had a very friendly atmosphere, and great vaules with their customers, workers and their families. I know more about Redcliffe than anyone, i've seen the staff come and go, and all the bowlers come and go. I was there when AMF took over.... and i got to see first hand the change in atmosphere. AMF prices are all based on Sydney incomes, which is just not good enough!! Us up here in brisbane earn about 20-30% less than sydney's income. (hopefully not exagerating too much).....
Before AMF, redcliffe had a club 2000 card for their juniors, which ment that when they bowled up 2000 pins they recieved a free game, plus, 2 free games for their birthday!! As a staff members family, i was treated like a princess..... For example, when i was 10, i got shown how to use the computer, if i wiped up tables or something i got 10 free games, and just little stuff like that.
As for AMF, they took over Redcliffe in 1998, and surposidely offer discount to staff and their immedent families, including discount at the cafe's, free ball polishing ect..... Well, ever since 1998, i ain't seen any of that!!!! :evil:
I ended up taking 10 months off bowling this year, and sorry for redcliffe, but i am bowling at another privately owned centre 'Caboolture Bowl' owned by Brian Bates, and it has an absolutly wonderful atmosphere, everything that redcliffe and other AMF centre's are missing!!
AMF..... Another Major F***-up!!
 
On the subjuect of bowling politics.....
I bowled in a tournament today..... just a little one, and the entry form stated 'highest league average as at 30th september 2003', which for me then (only being back at bowling for 1 month) was 166. The entry form did not state all TBA rules apply, but it did state a dress code which said collared shirts ect.
Well, a lot of contraversy went up about my average, before today, as they all know at that centre that i am capable of averaging 200 scratch in recently held tournaments there.
I recieved a phone call the day before saying that my entering average has been changed to 185 because TBA rules say tournament average taken over 21 games, which by then, in the league that i was subbing in i had bowled a 290 and was averaging 200's every night.
So my thing is, they kicked up a fuss about my average....... but didn't stick to the rules about dress code, because they didn't want to loose the teams. There was men bowling in boardies and demin shorts and chicks bowling in skimpy little aerobic's outfits.......... What's this about tournament rules..... Wait... there is one rule for me...... and another for everyone else.....
I ended up averaging 215 scratch in qualifying, but thats not the point!!
It didn't bother me going in on 185, considering i know what im capable of, but the entry form said 'highest league average as at 30th september 2003'
So why did they hit me with the books!! (My average) but not hit stick with the rules for dress code........
Its no biggy..... but its just the 'moral' of the whole thing....
If you have rules, then you need to stick to ALL of them, not just the ones that siut you!!
MORALS!! that's all it is......

Whats the point in having rules if your just going to change them to suit you???
 
Hey 'the big hit'
I would just like to say that you make a very interesting point about the education of bowlers and what's to come after juniors. I would have to say that i am guilty of being a quitter!!! This year is my first year out of juniors, and i quit!! I had 10 months off bowling and got back into it cause i started to watch my dad bowl, and then i told him that i would like to sub in him team if they ever need anyone. I set up personal goals which i have just smashed!! :lol:
I did my level one coaches course when i was 17, and that has helped me a lot with my knowledge in bowling and i reccommend for anyone who wants to bowl tournaments and pick up their average to do it.
I finished juniors on a 175 average, and at the moment i have just been looking at tournaments, and ive just had a go. I've just tought 'what have i got to loose!!'
So far, since returning in August, i have bowled in......
The 5th Sports Series held at caboolture, 1st tournie back, came 16th and averaged 177.
Brisbane cup, came 48th, not bad, and averaged 188.
Sport Series final at Caboolture, i was sitting 2nd behind carl bottomly averaging 208 going into the last block, i ended up coming 5th with an average of 201.
and... Presdential Shield at caboolture coming 2nd with a 215average...

I have plans to bowl in the under 21's coming of age tournie in towoomba, and the redcliffe city open, they are both going to be big tournies, and test the tallent!!
So, thats just a note to let you know that, ex juniors can do it..... but i agree, i didn't really have confidence in myself to come back this good, or be able to match the likes of Carl Bottomly and George Frilingos!!
Its a big step from juniors to adults, and i believe that we need all the encouragment we can get!! I am blessed with the best parents!!
I say that because i remember all my junior tournies, and all the parents of other juniors.... I hate the fact that parents get shitted at you if you open a frame, or don't bowl your average..... Thats's life... Get over it and move on...
But thats not the case with some parents i know, and i think that ruins the bowling for the juniors too... :cry:
I've seen mothers in toilets with their daughters in tears and them screaming down there faces to 'pick up their act'.
I feel so sorry for them, and i am just lucky to of had the bowling up bringing that i recieved!!
Just a note to all of you..... Bowlings ment to be fun.... competitive...but fun....
If you miss a spare, or bowl a game under your average.... put it in the past, and think about your next shot.... Don't get too upset about it...

ITs just a Game!!!
 
I'm a jnr, and what i like about australian bowling is these tournaments that involve the older generation an the younger generation of bowlers, there really fun because the youngies and the oldies get along real well and they have fun and they still take the bowling serious. Like these Twin Tour Tournaments they are awesum! thanks to mary :wink: :wink: .

what i dislike about australian bowling is the attitude.. i was watching a tournament and it was a jnr tournament that consist of the 'mature' bowlers an the 'little ones'. And what really ticked me off is when an older jnr chucked a little temper tantrums and the little bowlers saw this as 'cool ' and did it to...!! they start young and they arnt infulenced by the adults! But its really stupid as well, because they're jnrs they get away with it :evil: makes u so angry! i think its time for the adults to put there foot down insted letting them get away with it! they start as jnrs and then youth then adults... like they say jnrs are the future of bowling! Whats gunna happen to the future of bowling, if they get away with this now? I'm not saying i'm a angel... but what i'm saying is if i do squick my shoe or use bad language i should be pulled up about it! most jnrs do it because they get away with it!

yeah hehe, had to say my bit... bowl well everyone :!: :!: seeyaz
 
A major positive of bowling in Australia is the competitive spirit it produces. There are many positives too many to list. As Kriddle mentioned, the Twin Tour is an excellent tournament and Mary and Co. should be congratulated for getting such a good tournament running and for keeping it going.

About Redcliffe Bowl, I personally think Redcliffe Bowl is one of the best going around in this area. They have made an effort to improve lane conditions recently and the staff are always friendly, some of the most helpful I have come across. I have only bowled there this year, but I think it is a very good centre. I can't comment about how staff feel or anything like that but from purely a bowler's view, I think it is one of the better centres going around.

Yes a negative of Australian bowling is some of the attitude. I am sick of shoe screeching. Anything accidental is obviously fine but usually if you are bowling badly you don't need to make a statement like screeching your shoes to let everyone know you are bowling badly. It's fine to get frustrated, that's normal, it's how you express that frustration that makes the difference. As well, if you are determined to swear, face the pins and do it.
 
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