Rachuig - play for glory or money????

[milton]

Do you think Rachuig bowlers should play for money???

The only way i can see this tournament producing the best bowlers to represent their state would be to change the format to a money format.

Do you think this would increase numbers or ruin this tournament.

Most bowlers i have spoken to admit they do not bowl because of the costs involved.

Rachuig has the potential to become the most prestigious tournament around if the bowlers bowled for money instead of glory.

 

[griggsy]

it already is prestigious, as everyone has said to me there is nothing better(short of representing australia) than representing your state in the toughtest state team competition in australia, i think in my opinion that making it a money format could make it prosper more but also ruin it... due to the fact that there will be bowlers that will go in it for the money but also lose sight of the bigger picture which is to work as a team and bond as a team.... you'll get people that are there for no one but themselves and it will take completely the emphasis off what the game is really about... plus too it will attract bowlers that know they basically can go in there and clean house and win every cent available which could throw alot of good talent bowlers off because they believe that they arent able to compete well enough to come out of it with anything... it basically goes both ways.. it could help the tournement but also could destroy it on the same token..
just my opinion

jason

 

[Shaun24]

Corect me if i am wrong but I dont think there is any torny in which you represent either your country or state that pays money.
Represeting state or country is about pride. This isn't just in bowling either, Davis cup (Tennis) and the olympics.

 

[RobbieB]

Many athletes are paid as part of rep teams. Davis Cup is the exception rather than the rule for high profile professional sports. Think rugby (both union and league), soccer, cricket... etc.

Paying prizemoney at Rachiag would be a very bad move, IMHO. If the money is coming from the bowlers themselves, this will act as a disincentive for the bowlers in the less powerful states, as they will be paying more to go for simply to donate to the stronger states. If not from the bowlers, just pay it off the costs that exist now.

Sponsorship and fundraising are really the answer, but require a huge commitment from both the organising comittes and te bowlers themselves. I do have a couple of ideas in this area, and hopefully I will be in a position to do something about it later in the year.

With the numbers of people bowling in each state in Australia, I would like to see some sort of goods and services catalog produced say monthly or quarterly detailing the products and services available from bowlers in your area. Businesses benefiting from anyone using the catalog, whether by coupon or referral, donate a fee or percentage back to the area fundraising comittee. Basically an avertising mag for bowlers businesses aimed at bowlers.

The amount of revenue needed to make Rachuig, DeVeer and Pres Shield fee-free is not really all that huge, and that would be the target. I think this is an approach that could work.

 

[Tiger]

A very good question asked actually.
I remember quite some time ago this was raised, and nothing really came of it.
It is a great tournament (I haven't bowled in one, because of the cost) but, I've seen three live and the atmosphere is awesome.
I think its biggest problem is that people are unable to afford to travel, and are unable to get time off thier jobs to go away.

Fundraising is without a doubt the key to it, however there are so many state teams these days, trying to fundraise for a team, you are competing for an ever decreasing slice of the pie so to speak.

Down here in Hobart for example, you walk in on a league night and you are asked to purchase a raffle ticket for Rachuig, Tassie Tourers, President Shield, Walter De Veer, ATBSO etc......there is only so much money to go around.
All the different fundraising that goes on, with the fewer bowlers we have in leagues these days (1992: 1577 sanctioned bowlers in Hobart - 2004: 465 sanctioned bowlers in Hobart) resources are stretched, and it makes it very difficult to raise decent funds for teams to go away.

Wether you make it a money tournament or not - I really don't know. It could enhance its profile, but then it could also destroy the very fabric of the tournament in a way.
Which ever way we look at I suppose, something's got to give shortly.

 

[milton]

Hello Tiger
They are alarming numbers you gave there.
How many centres are there in Hobart and surrounding areas?
And how many have closed down?
I know there used to be one on the way to the airport but i think that closed down ages ago.
But that does not sound good.
Jeff.

 

[Dj bruv on da mix]

its a tought one!.... There are two sides to every debate, but in my opinion Rachuig Should be Played for cash!, You have to be realistic here, how many different state teams pay for there own trip (accomodation,airfares,meals etc) Most state teams even get an allowance to cover meals while away, as some one said in an earlier post If you bowled for money it would be a disincentive to play! as the stronger states would be above the others....isnt this the case already????.

Weather you are playing for cash or prestige the weaker States will still send a Team. It Would almost Guarntee the Crop Of Australian Bowling Would bowl Rachuig.. Which would only help lift the profile of the game

mmm think i covered it.

Mark Foster

 

[Tiger]

Hello Tiger
They are alarming numbers you gave there.
How many centres are there in Hobart and surrounding areas?
And how many have closed down?
I know there used to be one on the way to the airport but i think that closed down ages ago.
But that does not sound good.
Jeff.

Hi there Jeff,
Yes the drop in numbers is quite sad really, you can walk around town here and see ex-bowlers everywhere you walk.
It used to be very community based, the bowling centres here, it was almost like a club membership.
Then prices started jumping through the roof, and the fringe bowlers all left.

There is only one bowling centre in Greater Hobart now (Moonah) for a population of around 199,000.
The old Mornington Tenpin was on the Cambridge Road, on the road to the airport, it shutdown on August 30 1992.
This started out as a busy little centre, but once the novelty wore off, the greater majority of Hobartians returned to bowl at a newly refurbished Moonah, leaving only the Eastern Shore people to bowl at Mornington.

Mornington was built in a dreadful location, a rather crappy neighbourhood (back then), and built virtually next door to one of Hobart's most violent pubs (Sun Valley Inn - Commonly known as The Blood Valley Inn.....Where the floors were concrete to make it easier to wash the blood away, and had the bullet holes in the bar ) Trust me, I drank in the place once........and once only :shock:
The nearest centres from Hobart CBD would be obviously Moonah {7kms North of the City}, Launceston Lanes {200kms North of the City}, Devonport {350kms North West of the City} and Burnie (400kms North West of the City}
Not much of a choice unfortunately. :lol:
If they'd cut thier prices down they might do a lot better, gotta spend money to make it :wink:

 

[milton]

Tiger
Are the centres owned by AMF?

 

[jockey]

I don't agree that any of the representative events available for bowlers, whether it be for your centre, state or country, should be bowled with the intent of making money.

I bowled Rachuig for Victoria last year in Townsville. As I was a late callup to replace a withdrawn team member, I had to come up with the required contribution to expenses in a much smaller time frame than the other team members did. But I did so and bowled in the event.

Why you might ask?

Because it is the ultimate event in this country. Despite what others in recent times might like to think, there is nothing like representing your state and earning the respect of your peers in this sport. You can't put a price on what this is valued at.

As here in Australia Ten Pins is not a sport where you can earn a living why would you want the ultimate event to be bowled with money as a consideration.

I agree that costs should be kept to a minimum but to say that this event should be bowled for money is not living in Australia's bowling reality.

I would like to know of any bowler who would not wish to bowl in Rachuig if given the chance. Hell, I was denied the opportunity this year to bowl in the trials because of my car and gear being stolen. If I could have found a way to bowl I would have whether it was being bowled in Melbourne or Timbuctoo. I know there will be one very disappointed person in Melbourne around Rachuig time supporting the Vics!

Controlling of costs is an important issue that needs to be addressed but Rachuig for money I believe would be the wrong direction to take.

Regards
Terry

 

[Jase]

I was denied the opportunity this year to bowl in the trials because of my car and gear being stolen.

Wish I had a dollar for everytime I heard this story!

Jase

 

[Tiger]

Tiger
Are the centres owned by AMF?

Yes Jeff,
We have Moonah which is an AMF run operation, which does quite well in the warmer months with open play. Apart from Sponsors and Centre League (16 and 22 teams respectively) the majority of leagues are now under 6 teams.

Launceston is also AMF, Burnie is a privately run centre (I hear Terry has done a marvellous job with things up there) and also Devonport is private (I don't know who runs Devonport, haven't been up there for donkey's years) I also hear Devonport is on the improve after years of neglect.

 

[Morwell Tenpins]

Rachuig

Rachuig is a great event and it has always been and always will be. To bowl for money would only solve the expense problems of the top 1/2 bowlers in Australia. Everyone else would still have to struggle to make enough out of Rachuig to cover all their expenses. You know most other sports in Australia have the same problems and they all have to fund raise to make it to the nationals. I have been lucky enough to have made the state team on several occasions and I was very proud to say that I represented Victoria along with past and current champions. I have also coached and Managed state teams and have been just as proud to be part of the Victorian team regardless if we won or not. I have also represented Victoria in other sports and believe me bowling leaves some of the others well behind.
Yes I agree that costs are high, and you guys keep blaming the cost of games going up and up, but what about your pay packets they go up and up,and if you were to compare cost from say 15-20 years ago it was actually a lot dearer to bowl for your state as the wages were not very good then and airfares etc were believe it or not a Luxary only some of us could afford.
The other ithing that veryone seems to forget is that when we travel to the Nationals where we all bowl in the championships and some bowl masters which allows you to win some cash if your good enough. And it is most of the Rachuig bowlers who pick up the majority of the cash. I love to see a run down of the last couple of nationals payouts to Rachuig bowlers for the championships and masters.

Anyhow perosnally I was always proud to bowl for my State and I always will be, I went to townsville last year and after an eight year absence really enjoyed myself and caught up with a few old bowling friends.

We have plenty of tournaments in Australia where you can earn cash and surprise surprise some of the very bowlers complaining about not going to state teams because of the cost do not go to the other events either. Most likely because they feel that they can not cash in these events either.........

So for me bowl for your stete because you are proud to be representing your state along with your fellow champion bowler.

 

[jockey]

Jase

I suppose you could pull gear out of your *** if your stuff got stolen in time to bowl in an event. As a left hander it is not easy to get shoes (dexters). Also most other items such as wrist guards are not easy to come by. I am still waiting on shoes after 3 weeks so I hope you have better luck if your gear is ever stolen. By the way the cars a write off.

I suggest you do some research before you make comments next time.

Regards
Terry

 

[Jase]

I suggest you do some research before you make comments next time.

Research!

I don't think I need to for the amount of times that it has been on this site in just about every post you have spoken in,regardless of the topic.

I feel for you that your left handed,and oh that your car is a write off and so on,but what you have to understand is that there are other people out there who have to cope with every day situations that are alot worse then the situation that you have found yourself in.

Please do us all a favour and move on and talk about positive stuff on this site rather than personal problems!



Jase

 

[Andrew S.]

This is getting off topic.
Milton raised a good point. Facts are that this year most States are struggling to field a half decent squad for a State roll-off. Victoria appears to be an exception.
However this problem is not just Rachuig related, De Veer is also struggling. It's all very well proposing that honour and glory should preside over the $$$ but where's the honour and glory when you've made a State team with little or no opposition at the trials ?
Wanna bowl for your State ?
Great, just write the cq and you're in.
One of the interesting facts of Rachuig is that there is rarely any comment on this forum from some of our top bowlers that don't participate. And that is a shame because they are the people who could possibly point out why the lack of participation.
My own thoughts have been long stated on this forum. I think we should introduce prizemoney into Rachuig and I think we should do it sooner rather than later.
The present system clearly is not working.

 

[GeorgeF]

I see a couple of problems with the current format, and I don't think money is necessarily the answer to our problems. I think one of the major problems apart the huge cost is the amount of time people must take off work.

Yes Rachuig is a great tournament but people are asked to fork out $1500 + plus take 5 days rec leave just to represent their state??? It's a big ask, perhaps a shortened format over a weekend.

National champs in the states run over several months allowing bowlers to attend the nominated bowl over a weekend convient to them. This year they expect to have over 4000 5 man team nominations!

Maybe if we as bowlers we allowed to participate on a weekend more convient to us and not at a nominated time Nationals entries would increase dramatically? Also a format where state v state doesn't exist over there either (to my knowledge). Do we have to prove each year whose the better state?

Also if Rachuif has to stay, it needs to be shorten I feel and run over 2 days, over a weekend.

My thoughts

 

[Feral]

Introduce double ranking points but leave the eligibility rules the same!!! :sleeping:

Can't imagine too many SQ elite bowlers venturing to Rocky even if this did apply. :sleeping:

Seriously though, separate Rachuig and De Veer from the Nationals and get TBA to cover the costs of an Interstate Challenge. I'm sure AMF would kick the can :twisted:

 

[jockey]

Jase

I'm amused!

Stolen from a bowling centres carpark! But Hello not related to bowling! Go figure!

Well Jase, I'm happy to say that I have just got Dexters and a Cobra, and new Bowling Balls and I'm looking forward to kicking your *** on the lanes in the future.